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2nd gen rear suspension
http://classiccamaroclub.mfatw.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1803		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  78 Camaro [Sun Jun 26, 2011 11:43 pm ]
Post subject:  2nd gen rear suspension
So i went to deflate the air shocks (wanted to lower it) as i was sure they were pumped up to raise the car, to find that no air came out :o
Then i added a footpump and gave it some air and could hear the air leaking out of the lines :(
Currently there is a good 4 to 5 inches gap between the top of the tyre and the wheel arch.

So this tells me:

1) the shocks are essentially doing nothing, right?
2) the car will only get higher if i add say, stock shocks, right?

so the questions i hope you guys could help with are:

1) what the f do i do
2) how do i lower it, with it being on leafs?

Thanks in advance for any help!!!

Cheers,

Ray
Author:  biff.bailey [Mon Jun 27, 2011 5:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 2nd gen rear suspension
best method of lowering it is to replace the leaf springs with a set of de-cambered (lower) springs......the cheapest way is to add a set of lowering blocks between the axle and springs.
Author:  chevy-stu [Mon Jun 27, 2011 11:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 2nd gen rear suspension
I'd take the shocks out, or certainly at least disconnect the lower bolt as it's just one bolt.. Then drop the car and see.

The shocks may be jammed or something, if the car still sits high then yes the springs are in unexpectedly good order, and you could lower it by removing a middle leaf, or replacing with proper lowered set (Hotckis, PTFB etc.. )
Author:  78 Camaro [Mon Jun 27, 2011 2:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2nd gen rear suspension
Thanks both!

Biff, good shout on the lowering blocks, i have seen these before and wonder if anyone has had experience with these before?

The springs were replaced a few years ago and they are in good condition which is probably why they hold the car up as you mention Stu. I'm a little reluctant to change the springs because they are newish (like the idea of lowering blocks) , but i don't even know if they are right for the car, as they make it sit so high compared to other 2nd gens i've seen.

I'm going to look into lowering springs, but last remember they only gave a drop of about 1-2 inches, attached a few pics below so i'm a bit worried to shell out if it still sits high - want the arch just about touching the tyre, so need a good 4" over what ever is there.

Pics below :)

Would love any more advice you guys can give!

Thanks,

Ray

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Author:  chevy-stu [Mon Jun 27, 2011 2:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2nd gen rear suspension
If the leafs are fairly new that explains why it doesn't drag it's arse like most Camaros on original springs..

The springs aren't that pricey, but if yours are newish I'd keep them. Apparently it's not too hard to remove a leaf from the multileaf. You just need to remove the spring and bend back the clips holding the leafs together, remove one, and bend 'em back. The 2nd longest is best I've been told.

It's hard to guess how low it will sit, even fitting lowering springs as everyone seems to end with slightly different results with the same products from what I've seen.
I've got the Hotchkis leafs and it sits about here on mine.. about 1/2 inch space to the arch from the tyre.
Image

(I'd also fit some proper big U-bolts instead of the T-bolts, and flatten out that spring pad..Looks very bent)
Author:  78 Camaro [Tue Jun 28, 2011 11:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 2nd gen rear suspension
Thanks for the advice Stu, you picked up on a few things i wasn't sure about too :)

I did wonder about the T -bolts, i've only ever seen U bolts! And the spring seats - i didn't know what they should look like so assumed this was how they were - thanks for point out :)

I do think that the effort of taking out a spring on each side, redoing the clips, redoing the spring seat, getting u bolts etc, which may only lower it a small amount, may as well (from lessons learnt with this car over the year) go for the full monty and whack on a rear anti roll bar while we are there.

Looks like it may be something once the car is on the road, need to get it on the road sooner that later now.

You're ride height is pretty spot on :) looks great how the arches brow the tyres, just how it should be!

Thanks or advice, looks like there will be some suspension replacement later this year.

cheers!

Ray
Author:  chevy-stu [Tue Jun 28, 2011 11:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 2nd gen rear suspension
If your springs have been changed a few years ago, it shouldn't be too hard to take them out and modify, and it definately will drop by removing a leaf, how much is a gamble, but so are new springs.
It's a free mod that's all and saves you buying parts, so only your labour cost.

Here's a pic I took couple of months ago of my new rear adjustable sway bar showing the spring pads, excuse the surface rust on the axle, and the leafs are only 3 years old so not painted to well by Hotchkis.
Image
Author:  78 Camaro [Tue Jun 28, 2011 2:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2nd gen rear suspension
Cheers Stu, picture helps a lot!

I think i will give that shot then, place near me should be able to supply the U bolts. I guess a standard high tensile stainless steel set should do the job?

I need to replace the shocks too, are you running the standard ones on yours? Thinking of gas - adjust shocks, would like Konis but too much $$$ i think.

What rear sway bar is that? while i have the stuff off i may aswel add this at the same time, any you would recommend in particualr?

My application is road / semi track. I would like to take it down the drag strip a couple of times and around a track too, but mainly use it as a cruiser, so i don't think i need too much in regards to suspension technology - just a step up from stock would be ideal :)

Thanks again!

Ray
Author:  chevy-stu [Tue Jun 28, 2011 6:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2nd gen rear suspension
I'm running Koni 3-position adjustable shocks all round. Minimum I'd reckon would be decent gas shocks. The Edelbrock IAS get a good rating in the states, and are cheaper than the Konis.
The rear sway bar is a Pro Touring F body 3 position adjustable. This may be overkill for what you want, so a set of Z28 bars (1 1/4" front and 7/8" rear) will work well...

Don't forget new bushes too.
(I've still got my special spherical front leaf eye ones to fit)
Author:  SoCAZ28 [Sat Jul 02, 2011 12:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 2nd gen rear suspension
You can have the springs re-arched since they aren't terribly old. Any decent spring shop can do that, and also adjust the spring rates...it's nice when they are the same on both sides! Your left shock plate is badly bent. Take it out, straighten it and check to make sure it's not cracked. What I did on mine was to completely disassemble the springs, sandblasted them and then took the whole mess to a spring shop. Had them re-arch them to lower it about 2-inches and installed new pads & clamps. I then went to Global West and had their "CAT-5" sperical bearings installed--the CAT-5 system uses sperical bearings on both eyes, which have to be welded in. I've attached a few photos to show what this looks like. Believe it or not, the engineer I have been working with at Global West recommends that you do not use rear sway bar with this system. Another modification you can perform with little difficulty is to modify the front spring bracket. Essentially, you move the spring mount holes upward by 3/4" and then open the top of the bracket for spring eye clearance. The purpose is to increase anti-squat. Most folks running autocross or road racing cars do this. I'd suggest that you Google "Herb Adams Modification" and look through the articles. You'll find pictures of how it's done. Some reinforcement is needed on the sides, because it does weaken the bracket. Hope some of this helps.

Dana

Attachments:
File comment:Front spring eye and spherical bearing installed. Having these on both ends (instead of just the front like the Hotchkis version) allows the spring to articulate as the rear axle moves...this keeps the wheels perpendicular to the pavement, maintaining a larger contact patch which enhances handling--greatly. GW does NOT recommend a rear sway bar with this system.
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File comment:Same shot--the flash on my camera has a mind of it's own
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File comment:Rear spring eye--GW CAT-5 bearing with GW shackle. Upper bushing is delrin with an aluminum sleeve and ZIRC fitting for lubrication (GW calls this "Del-Alum"). Note how the spring is tilted slightly.
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File comment:Believe it or not, this is the original factory F-41 spring--after being completely rebuilt.
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File comment:The screwdriver is pointing to the location where these will crack--this one has been repaired and powder coated.
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